b_side
Joined: Apr 14, 2004
# Posts: 2
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Posted: 04/14/2004 01:50 am
Hi,
I'm working on several new sites (3-4 months life), with pr 4, all pages optimized and indexed by google (same optimization techniques I use succesfully on hundreds of sites). I have no positioning at all! I tried to put the same pages on other domains and they reched top positioning. What's going on? Is google penalizing brand new sites?
Thanks!!
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EyesCoffee
Joined: Jan 31, 2004
# Posts: 204
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Posted: 04/14/2004 03:56 am
It could be that the first domain had a penalty that google has not taken off. Is the site new or has it been used before?
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b_side
Joined: Apr 14, 2004
# Posts: 2
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Posted: 04/14/2004 05:39 am
Sites are new, never used before
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Logan
Moderator
Joined: Aug 14, 2002
# Posts: 3749
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Posted: 04/14/2004 06:53 am
i work on new and established sites - my new sites are taking a notable difference in time to establish rankings after changes have been implemented - versus sites that have been online for a while with some links previously established. New sites seem to react different to changes (slower) than established sites when it comes to rankings - based on my experiences with new sites since florida/austin/brandy ...
I have implemented the exact campaign on a new site and an established site. The established site is already in the top 10 - and it only took 2-3 weeks ... the new site has seen no where the same type of movement (these are for very competitive terms).
I'm not sure i would term it a penalty - but there seems to be some variance imo
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jimish
Joined: Nov 26, 2003
# Posts: 68
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Posted: 04/14/2004 10:22 am
I have a new site that went up in January, was indexed by Google, and did very well in the SERPs for about 2 weeks. Then, pages started dropping off one by one. Now, next to nothing shows up in Google. Pagerank has been going up steadily, but what good is that if you don't show up in the results. Only very odd phrases that are minutely relevant to the page bring any results. I have done several sites using the same methods...content, good links, and keywords appropriately placed, consistent theme. This new site, despite adding more content, links, etc. daily is going absolutely nowhere in Google. And Google is visiting every single day. I believe they are being very heavy-handed with new sites. This makes it tough since new sites are most dependent on the SE's.
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ferret77
Joined: May 31, 2002
# Posts: 354
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Posted: 04/17/2004 05:33 pm
I have a couple new sites and the same thing is happening
in fact i have noticed pages that have my links with my key phase in it outranking the targed site
I also have been doing some more optimization on my homepage and i see drastic impovements in record time for the new phrases
I also have an old site which is suddenly is ranked top 20 for a very competitive term which i didn't optimize for , which is great but sort of strange
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excell
Moderator
Joined: Mar 19, 2001
# Posts: 14495
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Posted: 04/17/2004 08:31 pm
ferret & logan - did your new sites do well at first and then die back?
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Ches
Joined: Sep 18, 2001
# Posts: 114
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Posted: 04/18/2004 12:41 am
I am experiencing same problems with new sites I have created for clients.
Its a pattern similar to meeting a new girl at a dance. She flaunts herself, she makes a date, she turns up, she's all over you. She swears her love for you and you have a raptuous 2/3 weeks.
Then all of a sudden she don't turn up for a date and she don't answer telephone calls.
Then after a few months she starts to answer the phone, but not on a regular basis. By which time you could have met another girl with a strange name of Yahoo and decided to stay with her because she's more reliable and does not play tricks on you.
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Logan
Moderator
Joined: Aug 14, 2002
# Posts: 3749
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Posted: 04/18/2004 01:26 am
Ches ... let me tell you - it gets tougher. Wait until you get serious with that girl and decide that you can't go thru a day with out her. Soon enough you'll be setting up a budget to make sure the expenses of your time together are covered - she'll drain your account daily, leave you until you have more money ready, and sooner or later you'll make a stronger commitment and pay to guarantee your inclusion all of the time. Uggh ... commitments, marriage ...
Excel, my sites did fairly decent at the very start. Some good two/three word rankings ... but nothing great with terms that are pretty competitive. But with time those fell, and very few relevant searches are provided. I've played with it a little bit, after being on line for two weeks - we added a section of the products by 'artist' category. As those were added, they did very good - even ranking in the top 10 for the artist names at times (which were pretty competitive).... but again with time those fell out.
My guess is that there is an initial 'local rank' established based on the contents indexed from the site. But afterwards, there seems to be some delay with the role links play. Still waiting, so i'm not sure what to expect and i just keep building/improving what i can control.
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excell
Moderator
Joined: Mar 19, 2001
# Posts: 14495
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Posted: 04/18/2004 01:48 am
"i just keep building/improving what i can control."
Yes I think that is profitable, Google may work this out and it may not.. Got to look for the long term and ensure the site is going to succeed across other search engines.
I have just been reading in another thread and see that this thing is across the board.... One good tip I picked up is to manage client expectations early & another, if you have domains sitting out there (maybe with holding pages waiting for a site to be built, like I do) get them moving a bit.
Normally I will not allow spiders in until I have everything finished and go for the full "launch".. I am going to be rethinking this.. and get a mini version out asap... finish it later.. not ideal, but worth thinking about.
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ferret77
Joined: May 31, 2002
# Posts: 354
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Posted: 04/18/2004 06:07 am
umm, my 2 sites never shined as of yet
one is for super uncompetitve term si slowly creeping inot top ten
I really thought it would debute at 1
the other is for a pretty big terms, its floating in the 90-300 area
they guy who owns it is happy becuase its such an imporvement from being 1000+
but since i don't get paid unless its hits top 10 , I'm not as estatatic
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excell
Moderator
Joined: Mar 19, 2001
# Posts: 14495
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Posted: 04/18/2004 06:49 am
ferret? they sound like existing sites not brand new ones?
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ferret77
Joined: May 31, 2002
# Posts: 354
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Posted: 04/18/2004 07:13 am
i guess that sort of true , both existed but but they had no little no pr
so they might as well not existed
I didn't think of it that way, they both had been online and optimized by other people with no results
eihter my probelem is tottally unrelated to your or the problem is involing sites with little or no pr instead of new sites
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excell
Moderator
Joined: Mar 19, 2001
# Posts: 14495
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Posted: 04/18/2004 07:19 am
Be careful of trying to optimise on sites that have been handled by prior SEOs.. I have a classic that dates back 2years to the goodold PRZero fiasco, still holding that same penalty all this time because the SEO wasn't wise enough to trash the domain.
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ferret77
Joined: May 31, 2002
# Posts: 354
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Posted: 04/18/2004 07:46 am
I don't they were penaized i think some "content" seo took 500.00 to increase the keyword density a little and put some keyword in the title
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excell
Moderator
Joined: Mar 19, 2001
# Posts: 14495
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Posted: 04/18/2004 07:53 am
That sounds ok then, but yes I think your problem is outside this threads topic(not related to new problems).
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vg5518
Joined: May 28, 2002
# Posts: 218
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Posted: 04/18/2004 08:14 am
I have 2 sites that were launched around September of 2003 and had first page rankings for their most important phrases for about 2-4 months. One disappeared in Florida and is just in the last week starting to show up in the top 200 : after not being in the top 1000 after Florida.
The other disappeared around February and is yet to appear in the top 1,000.
Another one that is not new (2-3 yrs. old) and was ranking first page for its most important key phrases until January is still nowhere to be found.
All 3 are still waiting to be included in dmoz (common thread from what I can see). (The last one that I mentioned that is 2-3 yrs. old was not submitted to dmoz until I took it over about a year ago. You'd think it would be included by now.)
The other common thread is that all of their most important phrases begin with "city" key phrase, or key phrase "city".
One has PR4 and the other 2 have PR5.
Anyone else seeing this pattern?
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jimjo
Joined: Apr 04, 2004
# Posts: 2
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Posted: 04/19/2004 06:02 am
I've optimized my pages for a lot of keywords and phrases that are pretty much overwhelmed by off-target sites. For instance, I have a 2-word phrase that runs throughout the theme of the site. If I use that with another keyword to define it, a different set of results will come up every time I change that 3rd keyword. But none of them is really relevant to that 3rd keyword. I notice that science sites will get priority, even though they have absolutely nothing to do with the subject. If they have even one of the keywords, they'll come up close to the number 1 position. What's that about?
Everyone is optimizing using other resources by now. My guess is that by the time Google gets around to putting our sites where they belong, we'll have established ourselves elseware, and this is the beginning of the end for Google's monarchy. I've noticed over the years that whenever a search engine hammers the webmasters, they're really banging themselves over the head, because it's mostly webmasters that create and optimize sites. Other than us, you have a lot of personal sites. Lock out the webmasters and SEO's and you'll find yourself on the wrong side of that locked door.
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cianuro
Joined: Jan 22, 2004
# Posts: 164
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Posted: 04/23/2004 11:38 am
I link my new sites as I am building them.
My latest project started about 2 months ago and I linked before I even started, just to let the bots in.
Now that the site is almost complete, EVERY page is ranking very well in google after 2 months. I have not even properly optomized it yet.
It ranked good surprisingly after about 3 weeks, but then dropped away to nothing. Now its back, just in time for its REal-release.
Its almost like google wants to make sure its not indexing "flybynight" companies/websites.
Just my 2 Euros... 
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flower
Joined: Jan 26, 2002
# Posts: 2
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Posted: 04/23/2004 11:51 am
Wow that same topic just came up with some friends.
so my question is ?
My site is about a year and half years old and i have good pagerank
but i don't have very good rankings in the search terms that i optamize for.
What's up confused flowers guy>>>> 
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